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На костяшках следует заякоривать типа "исполнение" рефрейминга. Итоговое исполнение р. уже без сигналов.
Это как? Без обратной связи?
Но, есть вариант, когда на костяшках:
-- заякоривают одни только инструкции
--затем делают такой молчаливый рефрейминг, нажимая одни только костяшки вместо инструкций
--но, следует обязательно сохранить минимальную вербальную компоненту типа вербального отсчета шагов - "шаг первый" + якорь первой костяшки; "шаг второй" + якорь второй костяшки и т.п.
--сигналы должны сообщать об окончании процесса каждого конкретного шага
Именно такой использую.
--В большинстве случаев мои части используют уже устоявшуюся систему сигналов.
-Замечательно. Тогда, проблем быть не должно.
--Здесь же, в ответ на соответствующие "нажатия", начали проявляться другие сигналы.
Я имею в виду, что часть, ответственная за возражения \ непродуктивное поведения отвечает не устоявшимся сигналом "Нет", а некоторым другим, который нетипичен для меня. На этапе формирования сигналинга. А потом все нормально идет.
Что это значит: "...сам привыкать доверять...", - ты им что, изначально НЕ доверяешь?
Ну, вот тогда и выскакивает типа оскорбленная моделирующая/программирующая часть с возмущением типа "да сколько же можно не доверять?!"
После долгой практики вербальной подачи себе-инструкций и получения типовых сигналов "да-нет" лишь с редкими исключениями, меня удивили:
- необычность исполнения Р. с процинструкциями на костяшках и минимальным вербальным сопровождением;
- необычный\нетипичный сигнал "Нет" от одной из частей, с которой проводил Р.
Может, и правда есть легкое изначальное удивление-недоверие.
Это как? Без обратной связи?
Но, есть вариант, когда на костяшках:
-- заякоривают одни только инструкции
--затем делают такой молчаливый рефрейминг, нажимая одни только костяшки вместо инструкций
--но, следует обязательно сохранить минимальную вербальную компоненту типа вербального отсчета шагов - "шаг первый" + якорь первой костяшки; "шаг второй" + якорь второй костяшки и т.п.
--сигналы должны сообщать об окончании процесса каждого конкретного шага
Именно такой использую.
--В большинстве случаев мои части используют уже устоявшуюся систему сигналов.
-Замечательно. Тогда, проблем быть не должно.
--Здесь же, в ответ на соответствующие "нажатия", начали проявляться другие сигналы.
Я имею в виду, что часть, ответственная за возражения \ непродуктивное поведения отвечает не устоявшимся сигналом "Нет", а некоторым другим, который нетипичен для меня. На этапе формирования сигналинга. А потом все нормально идет.
Что это значит: "...сам привыкать доверять...", - ты им что, изначально НЕ доверяешь?
Ну, вот тогда и выскакивает типа оскорбленная моделирующая/программирующая часть с возмущением типа "да сколько же можно не доверять?!"
После долгой практики вербальной подачи себе-инструкций и получения типовых сигналов "да-нет" лишь с редкими исключениями, меня удивили:
- необычность исполнения Р. с процинструкциями на костяшках и минимальным вербальным сопровождением;
- необычный\нетипичный сигнал "Нет" от одной из частей, с которой проводил Р.
Может, и правда есть легкое изначальное удивление-недоверие.
Заякорил процинструкции для Р. на костяшки пальцев. (Есть ли у вас опыт, как лучше это делать?). И провел несколько рефреймингов.
На костяшках следует заякоривать типа "исполнение" рефрейминга. Итоговое исполнение р. уже без сигналов.
Но, есть вариант, когда на костяшках:
-- заякоривают одни только инструкции
--затем делают такой молчаливый рефрейминг, нажимая одни только костяшки вместо инструкций
--но, следует обязательно сохранить минимальную вербальную компоненту типа вербального отсчета шагов - "шаг первый" + якорь первой костяшки; "шаг второй" + якорь второй костяшки и т.п.
--сигналы должны сообщать об окончании процесса каждого конкретного шага
В большинстве случаев мои части используют уже устоявшуюся систему сигналов.
Замечательно. Тогда, проблем быть не должно.
Здесь же, в ответ на соответствующие "нажатия", начали проявляться другие сигналы.
Это может означать:
--появление некоей побочной части, которую следует обработать в манере, предписанной моделью рефрейминга с параллельным появлением нескольких побочных частей (см. книгу "рефрейминг", гл. "ГЛАВА 4 Расширенное изложение схемы шестишагового рефрейминга " http://lib.ru/NLP/refrejming.txt_with-big-pictures.html#4 )
--поскольку ты достаточно попрактиковал исполнение р., то у тебя не могла не сформироваться некая моделирующая часть. Она считает, что только она должна/может проводить р. в некоей свободно-нестандартной форме. А р. на якорях-костяшках точно какая-то нестандартная свободная форма процедуры.
...ну, это первые предположения, которые стоит проверить.
И еще - удивительным образом повторяется ситуация 5-летней давности, когда сам начинаю привыкать доверять ответным сигналам и последующим результатам:)
Что это значит: "...сам привыкать доверять...", - ты им что, изначально НЕ доверяешь?
Ну, вот тогда и выскакивает типа оскорбленная моделирующая/программирующая часть с возмущением типа "да сколько же можно не доверять?!"
Если помните, в момент освоения нашей группой авто-рефрейминга, шли продолжительные дискуссии по поводу доверия сигналам и пр.
Я помню.
На костяшках следует заякоривать типа "исполнение" рефрейминга. Итоговое исполнение р. уже без сигналов.
Но, есть вариант, когда на костяшках:
-- заякоривают одни только инструкции
--затем делают такой молчаливый рефрейминг, нажимая одни только костяшки вместо инструкций
--но, следует обязательно сохранить минимальную вербальную компоненту типа вербального отсчета шагов - "шаг первый" + якорь первой костяшки; "шаг второй" + якорь второй костяшки и т.п.
--сигналы должны сообщать об окончании процесса каждого конкретного шага
В большинстве случаев мои части используют уже устоявшуюся систему сигналов.
Замечательно. Тогда, проблем быть не должно.
Здесь же, в ответ на соответствующие "нажатия", начали проявляться другие сигналы.
Это может означать:
--появление некоей побочной части, которую следует обработать в манере, предписанной моделью рефрейминга с параллельным появлением нескольких побочных частей (см. книгу "рефрейминг", гл. "ГЛАВА 4 Расширенное изложение схемы шестишагового рефрейминга " http://lib.ru/NLP/refrejming.txt_with-big-pictures.html#4 )
--поскольку ты достаточно попрактиковал исполнение р., то у тебя не могла не сформироваться некая моделирующая часть. Она считает, что только она должна/может проводить р. в некоей свободно-нестандартной форме. А р. на якорях-костяшках точно какая-то нестандартная свободная форма процедуры.
...ну, это первые предположения, которые стоит проверить.
И еще - удивительным образом повторяется ситуация 5-летней давности, когда сам начинаю привыкать доверять ответным сигналам и последующим результатам:)
Что это значит: "...сам привыкать доверять...", - ты им что, изначально НЕ доверяешь?
Ну, вот тогда и выскакивает типа оскорбленная моделирующая/программирующая часть с возмущением типа "да сколько же можно не доверять?!"
Если помните, в момент освоения нашей группой авто-рефрейминга, шли продолжительные дискуссии по поводу доверия сигналам и пр.
Я помню.
The book describes a variety of different problems, so that people can understand the dynamics and kinds of experiences that cause them. I lead readers through the EMDR therapy self-help techniques that people can use on their own, as well as certain processing that can be safely done at home.
Lots of people don’t have thereapists available or don’t believe in thereapy, but this allows them to have their own positive experiences and insights so that they can understand with more compassion for themselves and others.
The royalties for the book are going to the HAP and to the EMDR Research Foundation. It feels good that readers are both helping themselves and people all over the world.
Bill O’Hanlon, MS, has written more than 30 books, appeared on Oprah with his book Do One Thing Different, and has been a top-rated
presenter at psychotherapy conferences all over the world. He was a student of the late Milton H. Erickson, MD, and created Solution-Oriented
Therapy and Possibility Therapy. Find
him at http://billohanlon.com/.
Lots of people don’t have thereapists available or don’t believe in thereapy, but this allows them to have their own positive experiences and insights so that they can understand with more compassion for themselves and others.
The royalties for the book are going to the HAP and to the EMDR Research Foundation. It feels good that readers are both helping themselves and people all over the world.
Bill O’Hanlon, MS, has written more than 30 books, appeared on Oprah with his book Do One Thing Different, and has been a top-rated
presenter at psychotherapy conferences all over the world. He was a student of the late Milton H. Erickson, MD, and created Solution-Oriented
Therapy and Possibility Therapy. Find
him at http://billohanlon.com/.
--BOH: You started out with your own crisis of health and stress. Then you came up with EMDR, explored both the scientific and practical routes, and wanted to put it out in the world to help relieve suffering. Now we’ve got the organization built up so that it can respond to global situations. If we can make a big enough splash that we can create these ripples of connection and peace…
--FS: Yes. And part of the work is educating the public about what’s running them. My most recent book, Getting Past Your Past, is for laypeople to understand from the EMDR therapy perspective how so much of the pain and guilt and shame that they’re feeling is the result of unprocessed memories.
It’s a physical problem. It’s not like, “You should have snapped out of it,” or “Why can’t you adjust?” Everyone has an information processing system that’s supposed to take things to resolution, but if it gets overwhelmed because of a high level of disturbance, the memory of the event gets locked in the brain.
Those negative emotions and sensations and beliefs that occurred
when they were children, are still locked in because the memory simply can’t link up with anything more adaptive.
There is no shame in going to aphysician if you break your leg. Like wise, there should be no stigma in going to get therapy in order to make sure that you can achieve full mental health.
--FS: Yes. And part of the work is educating the public about what’s running them. My most recent book, Getting Past Your Past, is for laypeople to understand from the EMDR therapy perspective how so much of the pain and guilt and shame that they’re feeling is the result of unprocessed memories.
It’s a physical problem. It’s not like, “You should have snapped out of it,” or “Why can’t you adjust?” Everyone has an information processing system that’s supposed to take things to resolution, but if it gets overwhelmed because of a high level of disturbance, the memory of the event gets locked in the brain.
Those negative emotions and sensations and beliefs that occurred
when they were children, are still locked in because the memory simply can’t link up with anything more adaptive.
There is no shame in going to aphysician if you break your leg. Like wise, there should be no stigma in going to get therapy in order to make sure that you can achieve full mental health.
--BOH: This leads me to the last question. One afternoon when we were both teaching at a conference, I said, “You’ve traveled around the world, you’ve written these books, and you’ve done all this work… why?” And you said, “I want to help create world peace.” And I said, “World peace, from waving your fingers in somebody’s eyes? How does that happen?” Can you talk about that?
--FS: If you’re trying to bring people together around a conference table when they’ve been exposed to the ethno-political damage from all these wars, they can’t connect because the unprocessed memories from those traumas keep getting triggered. The anger, the “You’re an Other” is there automatically. If we can process that, then they can make connections and reconciliations.
For instance, one of the trainings we did in Northern Ireland included Catholic and Protestant clinicians learning the procedures together. By the end of it, we managed to defuse an IRA death threat because the folks could see the connections being made. When you do EMDR therapy training, people are working on their own experiences, so they understand what’s happened. They can see what’s been driving some of their automatic responses. They develop more compassion for themselves and for others.
Although the results have been quite wonderful, there’s clearly a lot more that needs to be done. There are many more populations in need and a huge amount of negative psychological and physical effects that many clinicians misdiagnose.
--FS: If you’re trying to bring people together around a conference table when they’ve been exposed to the ethno-political damage from all these wars, they can’t connect because the unprocessed memories from those traumas keep getting triggered. The anger, the “You’re an Other” is there automatically. If we can process that, then they can make connections and reconciliations.
For instance, one of the trainings we did in Northern Ireland included Catholic and Protestant clinicians learning the procedures together. By the end of it, we managed to defuse an IRA death threat because the folks could see the connections being made. When you do EMDR therapy training, people are working on their own experiences, so they understand what’s happened. They can see what’s been driving some of their automatic responses. They develop more compassion for themselves and for others.
Although the results have been quite wonderful, there’s clearly a lot more that needs to be done. There are many more populations in need and a huge amount of negative psychological and physical effects that many clinicians misdiagnose.
--BOH: Which has gone on to respond to many other world crises.
--FS: The Balkans, after 9/11, after Katrina and Sandy, after the tsunamis in Asia, etc. Something beautiful about it is that these clinicians are donating their time. We’ve sometimes funded projects through the equivalent of bake sales. But we feel it’s extremely important to do what we can. We’ve also developed trauma response networks throughout the U.S. that have responded after events like the Newtown shootings, Boston Marathon bombing, and Arizona fires.
Also, all the international humanitarian assistance programs from the U.S. and the EMDR Europe Association resulted in trained clinicians in different countries. They set up their own EMDR associations, and then, for instance, the relevant national associations joined together to create the EMDR Asia Association about four years ago.
In Latin America, we got a request for help after a hurricane in Mexico. HAP clinicians from the U.S. went to investigate and there were schoolyards of traumatized children, so we trained the local clinicians. They developed a group protocol for EMDR treatment and published the results. Then, when there was a natural disaster in another part of Latin America, the Mexican clinicians went to assist them, and that’s how it’s continued to spread. Now there’s an EMDR Ibero-America Association.
We’ve trained people on both sides of ethno-political divides. In some places, historical trauma gets transmitted from generation to generation, and we can help stop the cycle of suffering and violence.
Israeli clinicians trained Palestinian clinicians, and now they do conference presentations together because the pain is the same on both sides.
What we’re hoping is, with enough clinicians treating the trauma in the different populations, we can bring people together so that these common denominators will become larger than the past historical traumas.
--FS: The Balkans, after 9/11, after Katrina and Sandy, after the tsunamis in Asia, etc. Something beautiful about it is that these clinicians are donating their time. We’ve sometimes funded projects through the equivalent of bake sales. But we feel it’s extremely important to do what we can. We’ve also developed trauma response networks throughout the U.S. that have responded after events like the Newtown shootings, Boston Marathon bombing, and Arizona fires.
Also, all the international humanitarian assistance programs from the U.S. and the EMDR Europe Association resulted in trained clinicians in different countries. They set up their own EMDR associations, and then, for instance, the relevant national associations joined together to create the EMDR Asia Association about four years ago.
In Latin America, we got a request for help after a hurricane in Mexico. HAP clinicians from the U.S. went to investigate and there were schoolyards of traumatized children, so we trained the local clinicians. They developed a group protocol for EMDR treatment and published the results. Then, when there was a natural disaster in another part of Latin America, the Mexican clinicians went to assist them, and that’s how it’s continued to spread. Now there’s an EMDR Ibero-America Association.
We’ve trained people on both sides of ethno-political divides. In some places, historical trauma gets transmitted from generation to generation, and we can help stop the cycle of suffering and violence.
Israeli clinicians trained Palestinian clinicians, and now they do conference presentations together because the pain is the same on both sides.
What we’re hoping is, with enough clinicians treating the trauma in the different populations, we can bring people together so that these common denominators will become larger than the past historical traumas.
--BOH: So it’s taken from NLP?
--FS: Well, you know NLP…
--BOH: I do, so I guess I can speak to it. I did learn a procedure in NLP of having people watch their eye movements while they were describing the problem, and then have them do different eye movements. But when I learned EMDR, it was a whole different procedure, which seemed to work a lot faster and a lot more consistently. All right, once you figured out this worked and the research started to come in, you then created an orientation toward charitable service in the wake of natural disasters and other mass traumas. Why?
--FS: Remember, I came into it from the position of having cancer, so my emphasis has always been on what’s going to work for the general public. Even though I had a behavioral orientation, because that’s what was being taught in graduate school, my emphasis wasn’t on academia, it was on: How do we help? What do we do?
Westarted the non-profit EMDR Humanitarian Assistance Program at the time of the Oklahoma City bombing because we got a call from an FBI agent who had received EMDR therapy. He said, “Could you please do something? The mental health professionals here are dropping like flies.” At that time, there weren’t any empirically validated PTSD treatments. It was considered intractable.
So, most of the therapists who were there hadn’t learned appropriate procedures. They were hearing all of the disturbing stories and developing vicarious traumatizations. We flew out a group of volunteer clinicians, did a needs assessment, made the appropriate connections, and began doing free treatment for the first responders and the victims. Then we started doing free trainings for the clinicians in Oklahoma.
The evaluations of that program indicated an 85 percent success rate after three sessions, which duplicateda study that had come out in the Journal of Consulting and Clinical Psychology that year, so we knew that we were doing what we needed to do. At that point, we set up the EMDR HAP…
--FS: Well, you know NLP…
--BOH: I do, so I guess I can speak to it. I did learn a procedure in NLP of having people watch their eye movements while they were describing the problem, and then have them do different eye movements. But when I learned EMDR, it was a whole different procedure, which seemed to work a lot faster and a lot more consistently. All right, once you figured out this worked and the research started to come in, you then created an orientation toward charitable service in the wake of natural disasters and other mass traumas. Why?
--FS: Remember, I came into it from the position of having cancer, so my emphasis has always been on what’s going to work for the general public. Even though I had a behavioral orientation, because that’s what was being taught in graduate school, my emphasis wasn’t on academia, it was on: How do we help? What do we do?
Westarted the non-profit EMDR Humanitarian Assistance Program at the time of the Oklahoma City bombing because we got a call from an FBI agent who had received EMDR therapy. He said, “Could you please do something? The mental health professionals here are dropping like flies.” At that time, there weren’t any empirically validated PTSD treatments. It was considered intractable.
So, most of the therapists who were there hadn’t learned appropriate procedures. They were hearing all of the disturbing stories and developing vicarious traumatizations. We flew out a group of volunteer clinicians, did a needs assessment, made the appropriate connections, and began doing free treatment for the first responders and the victims. Then we started doing free trainings for the clinicians in Oklahoma.
The evaluations of that program indicated an 85 percent success rate after three sessions, which duplicateda study that had come out in the Journal of Consulting and Clinical Psychology that year, so we knew that we were doing what we needed to do. At that point, we set up the EMDR HAP…
Заякорил процинструкции для Р. на костяшки пальцев. (Есть ли у вас опыт, как лучше это делать?). И провел несколько рефреймингов.
В большинстве случаев мои части используют уже устоявшуюся систему сигналов. Здесь же, в ответ на соответствующие "нажатия", начали проявляться другие сигналы. И еще - удивительным образом повторяется ситуация 5-летней давности, когда сам начинаю привыкать доверять ответным сигналам и последующим результатам:) Если помните, в момент освоения нашей группой авто-рефрейминга, шли продолжительные дискуссии по поводу доверия сигналам и пр.
В большинстве случаев мои части используют уже устоявшуюся систему сигналов. Здесь же, в ответ на соответствующие "нажатия", начали проявляться другие сигналы. И еще - удивительным образом повторяется ситуация 5-летней давности, когда сам начинаю привыкать доверять ответным сигналам и последующим результатам:) Если помните, в момент освоения нашей группой авто-рефрейминга, шли продолжительные дискуссии по поводу доверия сигналам и пр.
--BOH: So, it’s just placebo?
--FS: The two dozen randomized studies show it’s not.
--BOH: This isn’t a dismissal, but sometimes it was lumped in with another rapid trauma treatment that came out around that same time known as “tapping.”
--FS: The effects are quite different, and there also isn’t research in support of that.
--BOH: They’re just starting to do some research, but they didn’t emphasize it, which was one of the contrasts I wanted to make. Early on you said, “Let’s do research,” and they said, “No, it works in clinical use. That’s all we need to do.”
--FS: What you see that’s also different with EMDR therapy is that you get pronounced cognitive changes and insights going on as you do it. The disturbing event becomes a source of resilience. With EMDR therapy, if you have a single trauma victim with PTSD, the research indicates that 84percent to 100 percent of single trauma victims no longer have PTSD after the equivalent of three 90-minute sessions. And it lasts in follow-ups, so you don’t have to keep redoing it.
--FS: The two dozen randomized studies show it’s not.
--BOH: This isn’t a dismissal, but sometimes it was lumped in with another rapid trauma treatment that came out around that same time known as “tapping.”
--FS: The effects are quite different, and there also isn’t research in support of that.
--BOH: They’re just starting to do some research, but they didn’t emphasize it, which was one of the contrasts I wanted to make. Early on you said, “Let’s do research,” and they said, “No, it works in clinical use. That’s all we need to do.”
--FS: What you see that’s also different with EMDR therapy is that you get pronounced cognitive changes and insights going on as you do it. The disturbing event becomes a source of resilience. With EMDR therapy, if you have a single trauma victim with PTSD, the research indicates that 84percent to 100 percent of single trauma victims no longer have PTSD after the equivalent of three 90-minute sessions. And it lasts in follow-ups, so you don’t have to keep redoing it.
--BOH: So you made a commitment to make sure the people who do this research are well trained and that the research is solid.
--FS: Yes. Controversy about the eye movement being bogus is based on those early negative studies, but since then…
--BOH: More studies have comein, and they’re legitimate, valid, well-designed studies with people who knew how to do the procedure.
--FS: And a new meta-analysis just came out that evaluated the various studies and demonstrated definitively that the eye movements do add to it. One of the research supported hypotheses revealed that it indeed seems to link into the same processes that occur during rapid eye movement sleep. Another 12 studies have been done supporting another hypothesis - that it taxes working memory. I believe both of them are true. They just come in at different times during the therapy.
--BOH: So the procedure’s been validated, there are more studies going on, and hypotheses are still being investigated. Let’s address dismissals of the work. “It’s just hypnosis.” What do you say to that?
--FS: Well, it’s simply not. It’s a different brain state. There was a study that compared brain states between EMDR therapy and hypnosis.
--FS: Yes. Controversy about the eye movement being bogus is based on those early negative studies, but since then…
--BOH: More studies have comein, and they’re legitimate, valid, well-designed studies with people who knew how to do the procedure.
--FS: And a new meta-analysis just came out that evaluated the various studies and demonstrated definitively that the eye movements do add to it. One of the research supported hypotheses revealed that it indeed seems to link into the same processes that occur during rapid eye movement sleep. Another 12 studies have been done supporting another hypothesis - that it taxes working memory. I believe both of them are true. They just come in at different times during the therapy.
--BOH: So the procedure’s been validated, there are more studies going on, and hypotheses are still being investigated. Let’s address dismissals of the work. “It’s just hypnosis.” What do you say to that?
--FS: Well, it’s simply not. It’s a different brain state. There was a study that compared brain states between EMDR therapy and hypnosis.
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